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Report 1621
Report #1621 Skillset: Loralaria Skill: SkySforzando Org: Symphonium Status: Completed Feb 2017 Furies' Decision: Solution 3 with timewarp replaced with mental aff (as per 2), and gemmed effect changed to timewarp. Problem: Loralaria at the moment is heavily based around pre-overhaul conditions, sleep-attrition (which was removed) and Aeon. We would like to move away from these conditions and move towards a more synergized bard spec focused around timewarp and effects that play off of it. 4 R:10 Solution #1: Change SkySforzando take 4s eq to deal a 1s stun, a disrupt, and 1-2 smokes of timewarp for 3p. No lust requirement. If gemmed with a sapphire, it will deal 2-3 smokes of timewarp. 6 R: 6 Solution #2: Change SkySforzando to take 4s eq to deal a 2s stun, 2-3 smokes of timewarp, and deal one unmasked affliction from a table of (addiction, stupidity, hallucinations, epilepsy, luminosity, healthleech). If a sapphire is attached, will deliver two afflictions from the table. Afflictions should be smart afflicting. R: 1 Solution #3: Change SkySforzando to take 4s eq to deal a disrupt, and 2-3 smokes of timewarp for 3p. No lust requirement. If gemmed with a sapphire, afflicts with confusion. Player Comments: ---on 2/10 @ 03:25 writes: As requested, SkySforzando currently does: For 3p, target must be lusted to the Loralist, 4s stun+aeon. Chance of double aeon if gemmed. ---on 2/10 @ 03:45 writes: I believe current SkySforzando's gemmed effect is that it deals the second application of aeon 100% of the time ---on 2/10 @ 04:08 writes: In general, I have no problem with the intent of the report aside from the following - 2p is way too cheap for what the song will do, considering whispers is 1p for disrupt only while this song is 2p for disrupt/stun/timewarp. Further, most other bard power songs are 3p minimum. I would suggest raising the cost of all versions to 3p at least for both parity and to reduce spammability. Further, a 2s stun + disrupt on a 4s bard balance gives a very real possibility of eq- locking the victim perpetually (especially for 2p) - basically the bard can/will have regained eq by the time the victim recovers from disrupt -especially since timewarp increases disrupt recovery time-. I find these two issues to be very significant and I think the report should be reassessed to something like - 3p, 4s eq, 1s stun/disrupt/timewarp + extra chance to timewarp if gemmed. As-is, the report is asking for too much in my opinion ---on 2/10 @ 04:10 writes: Solutions changed as per above suggestions. ---on 2/10 @ 04:17 writes: I think 3p and no stun is fine even. The balance of this now and with potential future reports will depend largely on the ability of the Symphonium to build and maintain timewarp. Right now it's not possible at all for a Symphonium to build, and the proposal wouldn't change that. Even with an Institute, it's pretty dubious outside of relying on a Shatterplex burst. Second, you can't disrupt someone already disrupted or concentrating. This does have potential to get out of hand so should be watched to make sure it doesn't. ---on 2/10 @ 04:43 writes: Opposed to both. Assume everyone competent will minmax, so sapphire will be used. This is asking for a 2p skill that hinders significantly, including preventing tumble. Even aeon wont stop you from starting tumble. the off eq gets longer as timewarp does, so this hinder builds. I have not heard any justification of why it needs disrupt, which does not setup for a kill, and only makes things terrible. There is no fight if you cant attack. This report is too cheap, and is overreaching on the requested effects. Disrupt should not be a funsy skill, it needs to have a reason to exist. ---on 2/10 @ 17:16 writes: Support for solution 1 only ---on 2/10 @ 22:05 writes: I think for the purposes of discussion, it would be appropriate to share the ideas for the rest of Loralaria in order to properly make more informed decisions on reports like this, FYI. That way, we will not have to make decisions in a vacuum because single reports might be okay by themselves, but they might be crazy all together, for example. So if someone can make/share a link, I would appreciate it. ---on 2/10 @ 22:21 writes: The ideas for Loralaria are here http://pastebin.com/r4NbA629 ---on 2/11 @ 22:00 writes: This whole sheet looks like an intentional crippling of offense. There is no kill method in it, it's like you just want to be a sidekick. I am still against this report because of the disrupt (which would get ever worse). If you want to cripple your guild for some reason, that is technically your call until someone else dislikes it and replaces these skills again. I would advice removing disrupt and making it 2p for a stun with timewarp and maybe 1 aff. Assume this is a minmax skill and make the gem an expectation for viable offense. ---on 2/12 @ 01:02 writes: The solo kill method will largely remain dchord as it is for any bard, however the idea is to provide a thematic and synergistic way to provide pressure. ---on 2/12 @ 20:25 writes: After discussion with Shedrin, I will say that I would agree that removing the stun is preferable. Given that many halli envoys have confirmed the shift in focus to group synergy, I feel that the stun is probably unnecessary. Given a standard hallifax combat group, aeon will be readily available. If the intent of the stun is to provide a curing delay, I will argue that the easy availability of aeon (aeonfield, tarot, aeon move, etc) already fulfills the intent of the stun and is therefore not needed. Further, using this same argument, the ability to pfifth + disrupt + aeon gives a strong enough option to support the idea that stun isn't needed. ---on 2/13 @ 01:54 writes: Solution 3 has been added as per above comments to remove the stun option. Have changed the gemmed option to afflict with confusion in the absence of the stun. ---on 2/14 @ 05:04 writes: The concerns given from shuyin makes having confusion a bigger problem still. Now you cant move, and need to cure something to even try concentrate. I still do not like disrupt and think this skill is better off as timewarp + 1 aff + stun. I'd prefer that over a high strength (and potentially building) off eq that can just trash you. Off eq is powerful, and there is still no pressing reason this skill needs that. If off eq is needed, make it an off eq, not disrupt. ---on 2/15 @ 09:41 writes: Solution 2 changed to a solution without disrupt as per envoy concerns. ---on 2/16 @ 02:21 writes: After review, I'd only vote for 3. Don't need the stun and I don't think it's appropriate for solution 2 to cost no power for all that effect ---on 2/16 @ 03:37 writes: Oh, I didn't even realise there was no power cost stated in solution 2. My guess is that Asmodea just forgot about it. ---on 2/16 @ 04:56 writes: Yes, my apologies, Solution 2 should still cost 3p. ---on 2/16 @ 13:39 writes: The disrupt time needs to be clarified here. A normal scroll disrupt is about 4 seconds of eq knocking. I assume solution 1&3 are asking for 1-2s to match the suggestions for stun times. If the disrupt is 1s or so, solution 3 seems the most reasonable. Solution 1 is awkward in putting a disrupt overtop of a stun as well. ---on 2/16 @ 21:31 writes: All equilibrium disrupts are 2s base, only affected by eq bonus/malus and timewarp. Not sure what you mean by scroll disrupt. ---on 2/18 @ 01:17 writes: As noted previously, no support for disrupts that get ever stronger. Solution 3 then also adds confusion so in aeon (groups this is buiilt for) your cant start concentrating. Solution 2 should cost power but does a lot of affs. potential 5 steam affs in one hit? I'd be fine with pure timewarp and sapphire gives chance to do 1 random aff.